Curse

Nudge · Mar 03, 2005, 01:20 AM // 01:20

In case you aren't a Warrior buff and don't care too much to watch their attributes, there was a change in one of the skill lines from the previous BwE.
For each point of strength, you used to recieve 2% armor penetration, totalling to 24% when maxed out. Now, you can only recieve half that a mount with 1% armor penetration per point in the strength line. They also removed the penetration from a normal swing of the warrior's weapon.

For a while, I believed this would not horribly affect the power of the warrior. How wrong I was. From a personal standpoint, I never liked the spells that were associated with the Strength skill line. Many of these spells are speed or damage-from-energy spells. As a warrior, energy is scarce enough as is, and running from battle should be your last concern, as either all of your monks are already dead and you are one of the last teammates left, or a monk is still alive to heal you.

In a build that I have created, I used Swordsmanship: 11, Protection Prayers: 10, Smiting Prayers: 10, and Strength:1. Immediately after posting this on a strategy thread, I was informed that not using Strength was a major no-no. So I went back and looked at my damage numbers.

Using the handy-dandy calculations from "A Treatise to Combat Mathematics", I began to apply situations I may be in by using the equations.
Considering my Warrior is at level 20, I calculated the amount of damage I would deal with the damage-dealing-based spell "Galrath Slash". With 11 points in Swordsmanship, the base damage of Galrath is 29 damage. Given one percent armor penetration against an average caster with 65 armor would look like this in the equation:

Damage Dealt= 29 * 2^([(20*3)-(65*99%)]/40) = 26.89 Damage

I thought that all seemed well and good, an additional 27 damage on my attack was pretty nice. but what would happen if I took a point out of swordsmanship, and placed those points into strength? it would, after all, only lower swordsmanship one point and raise strength by 4. So I gave it a try.

Now, Galrath does 27 base damage. The equation looks like this

Damage Dealt= 27 * 2^([(20*3)-(65*95%)]/40) = 26.19 Damage

Hmm... 4 points didn't match up to the 1 point lost in swordsmanship. If I were to continue this pattern, I would soon lose more of swordsmanship proportionately to the strength gained, so in no way does strength beat swordsmanship in this situation. Then I remembered that I was removing damage from my base warrior attack that didn't use any skills. I started to feel uneasy about the whole "Strength" deal.

After further thinking on the subject, I realized that the loss of one in a mastery of a weapon vs the addition of 4 in strength could still work. With more armor on the enemy, the strength attribute points could be worth more (since percentages are a proportion). Take my previous example. For the damage dealt on the bottom to equal the damage dealt on the top (approximately), the amount of armor could be found like this:

29 * 2^([(20*3)-(x*99%)]/40)= 27 * 2^([(20*3)-(x*95%)]/40)

if x were 100, the then the left side is equal to 14.75, whereas the right side is equal to 14.71. So, basically, the enemy needs more than 100 armor for strength to be more beneficial than weapon mastery in this case. (this is also not considering the loss of normal melee damage by lowering swordsmanship, which further proves my point)

Yes, greater base damage in skills will also make strength more effective, but not too many warrior skills put more bonus than +29 damage on a strike.

Dreamsmith · Mar 03, 2005, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Okay, but if you're looking to do as much damage as you can with your sword, isn't robbing Swordsmanship the worst possible choice you could make? I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting you use Strength instead of Swordsmanship, rather it should be in addition to it. If you want meaningful figures rather than wasted calculations, how about lowing some other attribute to raise strength.

You've shown weapon mastery is more important than strength. Was that ever in question?

Nudge · Mar 03, 2005, 01:31 AM // 01:31

Even with lowering something else, it does a minute amount of extra damage, and only in skills. I'd do even more calculations if you'd like, but I think it would prove taking it from anywhere would simply be a waste of damage/buffing/healing power elsewhere.

And it did used to be in question, when it was still 2% for each strike.

Ensign · Mar 03, 2005, 01:48 AM // 01:48

Strength is effectively 1% extra damage per level against casters, 2% per level against warriors. As a passive bonus, I agree with the parent, Strength isn't worth the points you have to invest in it to get any reasonable effect. Strength is an attribute you grab for all of the solid support skills in the line - if you aren't interested in those, don't bother with Strength. Of course if that's the case you should probably switch primaries. =)

Peace,
-CxE

Sausaletus Rex · Mar 03, 2005, 02:44 AM // 02:44

First, it's inherent.

Yep, Strength without a weapon attribute is about as useless as Divine Favor with Healing Prayers. You wouldn't favor one over the other. However, if you're trying to deal damage then you could do a lot worse than a 10~12% increase to your DPS. That's roughly the equivalent of adding in a mid-level Conjured element or Strength of Honor to each and every weapon attack. And if you're not using weapon attacks as a Warrior you're not really trying to deal damage.

The real draw, of course, is in the skills. What's there are, indeed, skills to let you run and damage-from-energy skills. Adn there are indeed a vast wasteland of trashy skills within Strength. But you discount the power of a speed buff skill. You're a Warrior, you need to get and stay within melee range of your targets or you're useless. Sprint isn't to run *away*, it's to run *towards*. It lets you close with an enemy, stay with an enemy, and keep swinging away to pile up your damage. And also in Strength are the buffs and energy management skills to make your damage better and to let your Warrior continue to use the energy intensive skills.

Now, of course Strength could use a boost now. It pales in usefulness compared to Expertise or Energy Storage. But it's far more useful to a Warrior than any other non-primary attribute.